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	<title>Comments on: Xubuntu&#8217;s crisis of identity</title>
	<atom:link href="http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/</link>
	<description>K.Mandla's blog of Linux experiences</description>
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		<title>By: johnraff</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36097</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnraff]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:49:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36097</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[(KM, you posted while I was writing that. It&#039;s a pity wordpress doesn&#039;t seem to let you edit posts. Hope you base your tests on one of those boxes - the specs would be perfect for me! )]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>(KM, you posted while I was writing that. It&#8217;s a pity wordpress doesn&#8217;t seem to let you edit posts. Hope you base your tests on one of those boxes &#8211; the specs would be perfect for me! )</p>
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		<title>By: johnraff</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36096</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[johnraff]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:40:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36096</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Hi rp, the total of my computer experience to date has been Windows 98 and Ubuntu, + hardware at that 95/98 level, and have to agree that W98 is probably the snappieest system in general. However there are still some reasons to move to Ubuntu, or other form of Linux:

*Security is the biggie - Microsoft have abandoned W98 and, even with all the anti-virus and firewalls you can muster, if you use the net getting some kind of infection is only a matter of time. That&#039;s what finally pushed me to make the switch.

*More and more software no longer runs on W98, and hardware isn&#039;t supported.

*In spite of the initial hassles, especially with the kind of stripped-down systems that old hardware runs better on, Linux is more *convenient*. No searching the net for a driver to install every time you buy a new usb drive, one digital camera interface covers everything instead of a multi-megabyte driver for each maker&#039;s model, Ipods work without Itunes... 
Also, all the handy scripts you can write to do your repetitive jobs.

*Anyway I&#039;m posting this from a desktop with 128MB of RAM, 450MHz cpu  and about 6GB of hard drive, running Xubuntu 7.04 and I&#039;m quite happy with it. Just don&#039;t try to do do too much at once or you&#039;ll have to wait while the hard disk thrashes away juggling with the swap space. Firefox (Swiftweasel actually) with a dozen tabs open? No problem, as long as you&#039;re not running a bunch of other stuff at the same time. Eventually I&#039;ll replace it with an Openbox setup (now running on an even older laptop) for some mmemory savings and a little bit more speed, but Xubuntu 7.04 is really quite usable I think. I don&#039;t know how much changed with 7.10 or 8.04.

The laptop: (260MHz Celeron, 192MB, 4GB) is a sort of testbed dual boot with W98 and Ubuntu 7.10 + Openbox. General speed seems about the same, startup is 2:30 for W98 (a pretty bloated installation maybe) and 1:55 for Ubuntu. Firefox comes up faster on Linux too, though again that might be because it&#039;s got fewer extensions in.

I guess it depends on how much time you have to set up a system on those machines. (Presumably once you&#039;ve got one done you can clone the rest.) If it&#039;s a question of giving inexperienced users a system that&#039;s going to be hit by a virus as soon as they start using it, you might reconsider just stalling Xubuntu one one of them and seeing how it goes. 

Good luck! :)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi rp, the total of my computer experience to date has been Windows 98 and Ubuntu, + hardware at that 95/98 level, and have to agree that W98 is probably the snappieest system in general. However there are still some reasons to move to Ubuntu, or other form of Linux:</p>
<p>*Security is the biggie &#8211; Microsoft have abandoned W98 and, even with all the anti-virus and firewalls you can muster, if you use the net getting some kind of infection is only a matter of time. That&#8217;s what finally pushed me to make the switch.</p>
<p>*More and more software no longer runs on W98, and hardware isn&#8217;t supported.</p>
<p>*In spite of the initial hassles, especially with the kind of stripped-down systems that old hardware runs better on, Linux is more *convenient*. No searching the net for a driver to install every time you buy a new usb drive, one digital camera interface covers everything instead of a multi-megabyte driver for each maker&#8217;s model, Ipods work without Itunes&#8230;<br />
Also, all the handy scripts you can write to do your repetitive jobs.</p>
<p>*Anyway I&#8217;m posting this from a desktop with 128MB of RAM, 450MHz cpu  and about 6GB of hard drive, running Xubuntu 7.04 and I&#8217;m quite happy with it. Just don&#8217;t try to do do too much at once or you&#8217;ll have to wait while the hard disk thrashes away juggling with the swap space. Firefox (Swiftweasel actually) with a dozen tabs open? No problem, as long as you&#8217;re not running a bunch of other stuff at the same time. Eventually I&#8217;ll replace it with an Openbox setup (now running on an even older laptop) for some mmemory savings and a little bit more speed, but Xubuntu 7.04 is really quite usable I think. I don&#8217;t know how much changed with 7.10 or 8.04.</p>
<p>The laptop: (260MHz Celeron, 192MB, 4GB) is a sort of testbed dual boot with W98 and Ubuntu 7.10 + Openbox. General speed seems about the same, startup is 2:30 for W98 (a pretty bloated installation maybe) and 1:55 for Ubuntu. Firefox comes up faster on Linux too, though again that might be because it&#8217;s got fewer extensions in.</p>
<p>I guess it depends on how much time you have to set up a system on those machines. (Presumably once you&#8217;ve got one done you can clone the rest.) If it&#8217;s a question of giving inexperienced users a system that&#8217;s going to be hit by a virus as soon as they start using it, you might reconsider just stalling Xubuntu one one of them and seeing how it goes. </p>
<p>Good luck! <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: K.Mandla</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36095</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[K.Mandla]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 02:26:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36095</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[:D It is a little unfortunate. I haven&#039;t used Xubuntu probably since I wrote this post, and I don&#039;t imagine things would have gotten much lighter since then.

On the other hand, there are a lot of distros that are much lighter than Xubuntu and will perform much better on those laptops. Keep watching; anything Linux-based will be better than an unsupported version of Windows.

And send one to me, would you? I &lt;a href=&quot;http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2008/04/20/panic-mode/&quot; / rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;need one&lt;/a&gt; for testing. ;)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />  It is a little unfortunate. I haven&#8217;t used Xubuntu probably since I wrote this post, and I don&#8217;t imagine things would have gotten much lighter since then.</p>
<p>On the other hand, there are a lot of distros that are much lighter than Xubuntu and will perform much better on those laptops. Keep watching; anything Linux-based will be better than an unsupported version of Windows.</p>
<p>And send one to me, would you? I <a href="http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2008/04/20/panic-mode/" / rel="nofollow">need one</a> for testing. <img src='http://s1.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: rp</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36094</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[rp]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Apr 2008 01:10:30 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-36094</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[Well, its a year late, but I&#039;m glad I found this site.

I have a stack of 10 surplus P2-333 laptops with 128M ram and 6 gig hard drives.  My company was going to throw them out, so I said I would try to refurb them and donate them to a local charity.

I was contemplating trying the new Xubuntu 8.04 on them, but I see now that this will not be a vaiable option.  I&#039;ll go with the native OEM version of Win98SE on them and just install open office, firefox and some other freeware apps, plus a universal usb driver.  Good enough to surf and write papers with.  

I&#039;ve come to appreciate Win98 more as time passes by (geez, did I really just say that?) - it makes you appreciate how quickly we get used to the bloat.

Peace from Canada]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, its a year late, but I&#8217;m glad I found this site.</p>
<p>I have a stack of 10 surplus P2-333 laptops with 128M ram and 6 gig hard drives.  My company was going to throw them out, so I said I would try to refurb them and donate them to a local charity.</p>
<p>I was contemplating trying the new Xubuntu 8.04 on them, but I see now that this will not be a vaiable option.  I&#8217;ll go with the native OEM version of Win98SE on them and just install open office, firefox and some other freeware apps, plus a universal usb driver.  Good enough to surf and write papers with.  </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve come to appreciate Win98 more as time passes by (geez, did I really just say that?) &#8211; it makes you appreciate how quickly we get used to the bloat.</p>
<p>Peace from Canada</p>
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		<title>By: K.Mandla</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3120</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[K.Mandla]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 15:46:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3120</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[:D Thanks for the comments. I could probably duck the argument by saying each machine is different and each user is different, but I think I&#039;ll just leave it as it is. I don&#039;t dislike Xubuntu, and I don&#039;t want it to change, I just don&#039;t feel it&#039;s an acceptable solution for older machines. :&#124;

@Isaac: That&#039;s &lt;a href=&quot;http://packages.ubuntu.com/feisty/utils/pcmanfm&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;PCManFM&lt;/a&gt;, which is my favorite file manager over Rox or Thunar or anything, really. Light, fast and does tabbed explorer windows. It&#039;ll also handle desktop backgrounds and desktop icons, but I&#039;m an Openbox user, so that gets in the way. ;)]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p> <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_biggrin.gif' alt=':D' class='wp-smiley' />  Thanks for the comments. I could probably duck the argument by saying each machine is different and each user is different, but I think I&#8217;ll just leave it as it is. I don&#8217;t dislike Xubuntu, and I don&#8217;t want it to change, I just don&#8217;t feel it&#8217;s an acceptable solution for older machines. <img src='http://s0.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_neutral.gif' alt=':|' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
<p>@Isaac: That&#8217;s <a href="http://packages.ubuntu.com/feisty/utils/pcmanfm" rel="nofollow">PCManFM</a>, which is my favorite file manager over Rox or Thunar or anything, really. Light, fast and does tabbed explorer windows. It&#8217;ll also handle desktop backgrounds and desktop icons, but I&#8217;m an Openbox user, so that gets in the way. <img src='http://s1.wp.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
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		<title>By: jon benge</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3108</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[jon benge]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 11:01:42 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3108</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I agree with Danny, in that Xubuntu CAN be run quite successfully on older hardware, even Pentium IIs.

I run Xubuntu Feisty Fawn on an aging Samsung Pentium II ~333MHz w/ 256MB of RAM. While the boot time is a little slow, once the desktop has loaded the performance is very reasonable.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I agree with Danny, in that Xubuntu CAN be run quite successfully on older hardware, even Pentium IIs.</p>
<p>I run Xubuntu Feisty Fawn on an aging Samsung Pentium II ~333MHz w/ 256MB of RAM. While the boot time is a little slow, once the desktop has loaded the performance is very reasonable.</p>
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		<title>By: Danny</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3082</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Danny]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 02:47:49 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3082</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I&#039;d agree. Kinda. Sorta.
I have Xubuntu on a 400 MHz PII machine, and it runs just fine. Of course, there&#039;s 340 meg ram on it too. Xubuntu isn&#039;t a speed demon on that machine, but it&#039;s not sluggish. Apps open up soon enough, usually withing 45 seconds or so. Sometimes quicker. 

I&#039;ve run Xubuntu on a 600 MHz machine with 128 meg. Way sluggish. Much slower than the 400 MHz machine. 

If a machine has the memory topped out, Xubuntu will run fast enough for complete use-ability. I&#039;d take a SWAG that 256 meg is pretty much necessary for Xubuntu. And, 400 MHz probably would be the lowest I&#039;d recommend. But how much memory the machine has, not necessarily the processor, seems to be the biggest factor.

Today, I installed Puppy Linux for the first time (details on my blog). It&#039;s not a speed demon either, but it keeps the little laptop working. Pretty easy to use, too.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I&#8217;d agree. Kinda. Sorta.<br />
I have Xubuntu on a 400 MHz PII machine, and it runs just fine. Of course, there&#8217;s 340 meg ram on it too. Xubuntu isn&#8217;t a speed demon on that machine, but it&#8217;s not sluggish. Apps open up soon enough, usually withing 45 seconds or so. Sometimes quicker. </p>
<p>I&#8217;ve run Xubuntu on a 600 MHz machine with 128 meg. Way sluggish. Much slower than the 400 MHz machine. </p>
<p>If a machine has the memory topped out, Xubuntu will run fast enough for complete use-ability. I&#8217;d take a SWAG that 256 meg is pretty much necessary for Xubuntu. And, 400 MHz probably would be the lowest I&#8217;d recommend. But how much memory the machine has, not necessarily the processor, seems to be the biggest factor.</p>
<p>Today, I installed Puppy Linux for the first time (details on my blog). It&#8217;s not a speed demon either, but it keeps the little laptop working. Pretty easy to use, too.</p>
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		<title>By: Isaac Geronimo</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3078</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[Isaac Geronimo]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 01:45:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3078</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I have to agree with your thoughts on Xubuntu.  I admit that I tried it out a long time ago on some older hardware (500 MHz), hoping that it was in fact a &quot;slim alternative Ubuntu,&quot; but I didn&#039;t notice any significant speed improvement... although I certainly liked the desktop environment and was looking forward to watching its progress.  I too hope that it stands by the KDE and GNOME-based distributions of Ubuntu as a strong third desktop environment (as many are saying of Xfce itself, of course).

I also agree that for older PCs, sometimes Windows 98 is truly the only option.  It&#039;s pretty snappy, and there are a lot of free software projects out there that can give it almost the same level of desired GNU/Linux functionality.  It can even do slightly more than a trim GNU/Linux distribution in this proprietary binary world, but of course has the caveats that come with a Windows (especially discontinued) operating system.  I&#039;ve nonetheless tried that &quot;Fluxbuntu&quot; distribution out on an old Win95/Win98 laptop, and it performed moderately well.

This is slightly off-topic, but I was wondering if you could tell me which file manager is displayed in your &quot;Most recent game&quot; screen shot.  I compared it to Nautilus, Thunar, Dolphin, Konquerpr and even ROX-Filer, but I couldn&#039;t narrow it down.  I want to say that it&#039;s Thunar; Would that be correct?]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I have to agree with your thoughts on Xubuntu.  I admit that I tried it out a long time ago on some older hardware (500 MHz), hoping that it was in fact a &#8220;slim alternative Ubuntu,&#8221; but I didn&#8217;t notice any significant speed improvement&#8230; although I certainly liked the desktop environment and was looking forward to watching its progress.  I too hope that it stands by the KDE and GNOME-based distributions of Ubuntu as a strong third desktop environment (as many are saying of Xfce itself, of course).</p>
<p>I also agree that for older PCs, sometimes Windows 98 is truly the only option.  It&#8217;s pretty snappy, and there are a lot of free software projects out there that can give it almost the same level of desired GNU/Linux functionality.  It can even do slightly more than a trim GNU/Linux distribution in this proprietary binary world, but of course has the caveats that come with a Windows (especially discontinued) operating system.  I&#8217;ve nonetheless tried that &#8220;Fluxbuntu&#8221; distribution out on an old Win95/Win98 laptop, and it performed moderately well.</p>
<p>This is slightly off-topic, but I was wondering if you could tell me which file manager is displayed in your &#8220;Most recent game&#8221; screen shot.  I compared it to Nautilus, Thunar, Dolphin, Konquerpr and even ROX-Filer, but I couldn&#8217;t narrow it down.  I want to say that it&#8217;s Thunar; Would that be correct?</p>
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		<title>By: dosnlinux</title>
		<link>http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3075</link>
		<dc:creator><![CDATA[dosnlinux]]></dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 26 Apr 2007 00:00:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://kmandla.wordpress.com/2007/04/25/xubuntus-crisis-of-identity/#comment-3075</guid>
		<description><![CDATA[I just wish they&#039;d stop compiling stuff with unecessary GNOME dependancies. Personally, I can&#039;t see ANY added functionality between an app with GNOME compiled in and one without. The only reason I can see for doing this is a more unified feel of the desktop as a whole.

If nothing else there are plenty of other &quot;pure&quot; GTK apps that don&#039;t need GNOME libs and provide the same functionallity.]]></description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just wish they&#8217;d stop compiling stuff with unecessary GNOME dependancies. Personally, I can&#8217;t see ANY added functionality between an app with GNOME compiled in and one without. The only reason I can see for doing this is a more unified feel of the desktop as a whole.</p>
<p>If nothing else there are plenty of other &#8220;pure&#8221; GTK apps that don&#8217;t need GNOME libs and provide the same functionallity.</p>
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